Forums Splitboard Talk Forum Mt. Baker Backcountry Map Geo-database project
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  • #572312

    Mt. Baker Backcountry Map Geo-database.

    I’m working on a project for a BSc.Honors degree at the University of Fraser Valley that entails the building of a geo-database for the backcountry area surrounding the Mt. Baker Ski Area. It will include Georeferenced Maps, ski ascent/descent route data, digital elevation and topographic models, panchromatic images, and aerial and oblique photographs. It will cover the areas around Shuskan Arm, Table Mountain, Bagley/Chain Lakes, Ptarmigan Ridge, Lake Ann, Kulshan Ridge, Mt. Herman etc.

    A lot of the work will be done by generating the maps using ArcGIS in the lab at the University, but I will also be spending a ton of time out in the field collecting data and taking photographs. I really need to partner up with others for the field work. All that will be involved is touring and riding killer terrain, and maybe waiting around a few minutes here and there while I take locations with a GPS and take photos.

    The end results of the project will be placed on a open sourced database that anyone can use for trip planning and navigation. There will be no commercial use of the data and it will be available to anyone through the internet.

    If anyone is interested in helping out with GIS expertise or who just wants to tag along for the ride I’d be happy to have you along. I’m going to be out in the field Saturday to Tuesday starting in January. Just send me a personal message.

    #622062
    jack
    323 Posts

    awesome, just what the area needs: more people, and more people who know the good spots….killer idea…

    #622063

    @jack wrote:

    awesome, just what the area needs: more people, and more people who know the good spots….killer idea…

    Yeah, I hear that sort of criticism all the time. It’s bunk really, it takes a whole lot more than a map to get out into the backcountry. What it does is makes it safer for those of us who have the skills and abilty to get out there.

    The last database I created was for private interest, it was turned into a guidebook…sold a grand total of 200 copies – not exactly contributing to throngs of people!

    #622064
    jack
    323 Posts

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    Yeah, I hear that sort of criticism all the time.

    then maybe you should go ahead and take a hint and not do this.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    It’s bunk really, it takes a whole lot more than a map to get out into the backcountry. What it does is makes it safer for those of us who have the skills and abilty to get out there.

    actually, it makes it that much easier for the retards to get out there, if the website tells them exactly what they need to do. and puts legit users in more danger when they ski above you and generally act like idiots and do unsafe shit.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    The last database I created was for private interest, it was turned into a guidebook…sold a grand total of 200 copies – not exactly contributing to throngs of people!

    200 more people in that area would be way to many.

    #622065
    refried
    93 Posts

    There was a death just outside the Blueberry catrack on Sunday, the wife (on snowshoes) fell and slid 20′, when she got back to where her husband was he was no longer there. He was found a day later upside down under 18″ of snow, They think he was standing on a cornice and it broke loose.
    http://www.bellinghamherald.com/102/story/1162942.html?pageNum=1&&&mi_pluck_action=page_nav#Comments_Container
    No avy gear and very little backcountry experience in whiteout conditions

    #622066
    Ecobrad
    2068 Posts

    I think these arguments are complete bullshit!!!! What, you’ve never looked at a USGS map before? The KORE folks back in the day prolly complained that little sniveling gravity junkies will now ski above our meadow skipping hot spots. The availability of maps/information about safety is not a bad thing. Someone who’s interested in back country/side country is going to go based on decisions made before they ever get to bighorns map.

    I scoff at people that bitch and moan about the backcountry being crowded (except maybe the Wasatch since it’s relatively small, allows helis and is close to so many people). There are so many options that if your bummed by the crowds its your fault for selecting such a shitty tour.

    I appreciate your work, Bighorn, and would love to head out with you if I lived in the area.

    @jack wrote:

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    Yeah, I hear that sort of criticism all the time.

    then maybe you should go ahead and take a hint and not do this.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    It’s bunk really, it takes a whole lot more than a map to get out into the backcountry. What it does is makes it safer for those of us who have the skills and abilty to get out there.

    actually, it makes it that much easier for the retards to get out there, if the website tells them exactly what they need to do. and puts legit users in more danger when they ski above you and generally act like idiots and do unsafe shit.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    The last database I created was for private interest, it was turned into a guidebook…sold a grand total of 200 copies – not exactly contributing to throngs of people!

    200 more people in that area would be way to many.

    #622067
    Tucks
    19 Posts

    I ride in an overcrowded, uneducated, slackcountry area and I find that most people who venture in this area are not going online to scope the terrain first via maps.

    They are usually just following my tracks.

    The people who check maps are usually the educated riders or the ones who check what the need to do to be in the area. Not all but definitely the majority.

    And my guess would be that the 200 guide books sold went to people who try to use the area safely. Not really bringing in more people.

    But maybe if you asked him he could put the number of incidents in the area, what you need to be there, a link to a few accidents as well as the avalanche forecast, and a few other links like that. So anyone who uses this site realizes that they are getting into.

    Oh and I would help you but I don’t live there. But cool idea. Tell me if you come to CO

    #622068

    @jack wrote:

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    Yeah, I hear that sort of criticism all the time.

    then maybe you should go ahead and take a hint and not do this.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    It’s bunk really, it takes a whole lot more than a map to get out into the backcountry. What it does is makes it safer for those of us who have the skills and abilty to get out there.

    actually, it makes it that much easier for the retards to get out there, if the website tells them exactly what they need to do. and puts legit users in more danger when they ski above you and generally act like idiots and do unsafe shit.

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    The last database I created was for private interest, it was turned into a guidebook…sold a grand total of 200 copies – not exactly contributing to throngs of people!

    200 more people in that area would be way to many.

    Aside from the sour criticism of a few, by far I receive thanks and praise for the work I do. Most of the poopy pants criticism comes from those who’ve contributed very little to the sport. Of the people who do dumb things in the backcountry, I doubt few of them had checked a database or were carrying maps with them. As far as Baker goes, I had my diapers changed in that lodge, been going there for 33 years now.

    Why don’t you demand that Voile stop making splitboard components, far too many people are using them now. Or Sparks bindings, who do they think they are being progressive (sarcasm).

    I spent the last 15 years of my life pursuing snowboarding, and the past four as an Honors student in University. I am physically strong, mentally capable, and very tenacious….I will see this through, even if I’ve got to solo every field excursion.

    #622061
    Taft
    287 Posts

    I run both sides of this argument depending on whats being put out there. and sure we had a good old bitch session around a bottle of whiskey in the parking lot the other day about how crowded the local hot spot was. most of it came down to a couple of us jumping the gun, and some one dragging along an uninvited noob which kept us out of the hard the reach lines.

    I’m willing to bet that most of the people there that day heard about the place on some web forum and did just enough research to make sure there were on the right road then followed the nearest skin track.

    on line mapping, shit google earth has made the world a very small place, but most people have yet to figure out how to put it to use. the more info I have at my fingertips, the less people i’m going to see in the back country…

    #622069
    Tucks
    19 Posts

    I’m willing to bet that most of the people there that day heard about the place on some web forum and did just enough research to make sure there were on the right road then followed the nearest skin track.

    Ya there are definetly some but I bet more people are heading into your stashes because of this…

    and some one dragging along an uninvited noob which kept us out of the hard the reach lines.

    So he will grab a friend to go next time and his friend will grab a friend and another and another. More people probably end up in your stashes because you invited them or a friend.

    And this noob next time might show up with another friend who is an even bigger noob and they will both try to reach the cooler lines they heard you talking about.

    #622070
    fustercluck
    668 Posts

    I can definitely see both sides of this argument. Yes, it may lead to more people being out there, but hopefully those people will be less likely to make stupid mistakes. Along with this info there should be some info on safety and etiquette in the backcountry. As an example, a national snow porn mag recently gave general directions to a sidecountry stash that can have some severe consequences if someone ends up in the wrong spot, or in the wrong conditions. It’s very possible people may follow tracks that dead end in a rappel or large cliffs in that area.
    What I am wondering, though, is how someone is getting college credit in BC for spending 4 days a week riding and giving away stashes in the US. :scratch:

    #622071

    @mtnman wrote:

    I can definitely see both sides of this argument. Yes, it may lead to more people being out there, but hopefully those people will be less likely to make stupid mistakes. Along with this info there should be some info on safety and etiquette in the backcountry. As an example, a national snow porn mag recently gave general directions to a sidecountry stash that can have some severe consequences if someone ends up in the wrong spot, or in the wrong conditions. It’s very possible people may follow tracks that dead end in a rappel or large cliffs in that area.
    What I am wondering, though, is how someone is getting college credit in BC for spending 4 days a week riding and giving away stashes in the US. :scratch:

    UFV is the closest University to Baker and Abbotsford BC is the largest center near Baker. Mt Baker is just a few short KM from the border. I’ve been riding Baker my whole life, since Bellingham was smelly pulp town no one wanted to live in (It’s a really nice place now!) and Baker was only open three days week – it would have barely even survived without Canadian business. I’ve also done some research with the borderlands initiative between WWU and UFV.

    #622072
    bones get broke
    298 Posts

    @Tucks wrote:

    So he will grab a friend to go next time and his friend will grab a friend and another and another. More people probably end up in your stashes because you invited them or a friend.

    And this noob next time might show up with another friend who is an even bigger noob and they will both try to reach the cooler lines they heard you talking about.

    So I guess you were hatched as an infant with mega back country knowledge and experience then. That’s fortunate for you but the rest of us had to start somewhere. When I decided to become a splitboarder nothing was going to curb my decision. Without maps and things like Google Earth I would have been out there fumbling around making dangerous terrain decisions. If there was an aplication like the one described by the OP in my area I would’ve been much more educated. It’s not like the aplication is going instigate a mad rush into the back country. It’ll merely create a more knowledgeable use group. This is a good thing for a number of reasons.

    bighorn, if you ever feel like moving your project from the PNW to the San Juans let me know. I’d help you in a heartbeat.

    #622073
    Tucks
    19 Posts

    bonesgetbroke…

    thats not at all what I meant.

    What I was saying in the second one…

    So he will grab a friend to go next time and his friend will grab a friend and another and another. More people probably end up in your stashes because you invited them or a friend.

    And this noob next time might show up with another friend who is an even bigger noob and they will both try to reach the cooler lines they heard you talking about.

    …was this is how a majority of people end up in your stashes. You are bringing them. You are telling your friends and acquaintances where some of the good stashes are.

    I was not inferring that people shouldn’t be back there who are noob’s. You have to start somewhere and with a freind or acquaintance I am all for. Actually I think its the best way. I know I have done more then plenty of it. I am always looking for another bc partner and its a great way. Drag an extra friend when you have the extra gear and another partner.

    So basically I am all for this guys project and I don’t think it will really help many people into that area at all.

    #622074
    treepilot
    352 Posts

    @the mighty bighorn wrote:

    Mt. Baker Backcountry Map Geo-database.

    I’m working on a project for a BSc.Honors degree at the University of Fraser Valley that entails the building of a geo-database for the backcountry area surrounding the Mt. Baker Ski Area. It will include Georeferenced Maps, ski ascent/descent route data, digital elevation and topographic models, panchromatic images, and aerial and oblique photographs. It will cover the areas around Shuskan Arm, Table Mountain, Bagley/Chain Lakes, Ptarmigan Ridge, Lake Ann, Kulshan Ridge, Mt. Herman etc.

    A lot of the work will be done by generating the maps using ArcGIS in the lab at the University, but I will also be spending a ton of time out in the field collecting data and taking photographs. I really need to partner up with others for the field work. All that will be involved is touring and riding killer terrain, and maybe waiting around a few minutes here and there while I take locations with a GPS and take photos.

    The end results of the project will be placed on a open sourced database that anyone can use for trip planning and navigation. There will be no commercial use of the data and it will be available to anyone through the internet.

    If anyone is interested in helping out with GIS expertise or who just wants to tag along for the ride I’d be happy to have you along. I’m going to be out in the field Saturday to Tuesday starting in January. Just send me a personal message.

    I got a personal tour over a few days of the terrain in the original guide book for an area that’s not Baker – don’t worry “Salsa Verde” is safe with me – although like any stash, all you need to do is follow the tracks.

    I’d love this level of detail for my local haunt – I plan on exploring deeper but I don’t even know what GIS is, let alone have expertise in it.

    I can understand and appreciate the frustration of giving away secrets though in crowded areas with lots of competition.

    #622075

    I got a personal tour over a few days of the terrain in the original guide book for an area that’s not Baker – don’t worry “Salsa Verde” is safe with me – although like any stash, all you need to do is follow the tracks.
    [/quote]

    Yeah, pilot, i definitely left a lot areas out, Salsa Brava is one of RT’s lines. He was never worried about the book, he’s been touring the Salmo/Creston pass for 40 years – he can always find an untracked line and he can still kick all of our asses.

    Looking forward to ripping it up with you at the split fest…I may have to keep my true identity on the down low to avoid conflict though.

    It doesn’t look like I’ll have any trouble with partners, I’ve gotten a number of PM’s with offers of support – thanks all! 🙂

    #622076
    powslash
    382 Posts

    Jack, this will be ok, I swear. Something similiar happened to the Alpy bc a few years back,http://www.alpental.com/ . There was some grumbling when that site launched but now it’s largely forgotten. A map project like this for Baker is inevitable and I’m willing to bet it has zero effect on the amount of pow you shred. Some days are a shitshow and some days are epic. Thats true now and will still be true after all the Baker lokes get their spots blown up on the web.

    #622077
    powslash
    382 Posts

    3 years ago. Did this ever happen?

    #622078
    russman
    692 Posts

    @jack wrote:

    awesome, just what the area needs: more people, and more people who know the good spots….killer idea…

    +1

    #622079
    aksltxlt
    621 Posts

    When I was hiking the Baker BC there were tons of BC skiers, and the terrain was wide open, And the parking was unlimited. (That area might as well be mapped for the masses) To find that secret stash find a touring option with crap or grey area parking

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