Home › Forums › Splitboards › 25 vs. 26 cm waist
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- August 27, 2014 at 3:32 pm #580081
NeverSummerParticipantI’m driving myself crazy trying to figure out which waist size to get. I’m pretty sure I want to get a Venture, either a Zephyr or Zelix. I’m 6′, just under 200lbs, have only split 5 times. I want a NS prospector bad, but don’t wanna spend all that dough. I have found some previous year Ventures online for a pretty good deal and I’m getting ready to pull the trigger on either a 164-166. I like to ride trees, go fast, occasionally ride switch, and just bomb steeps. My resort board has been Lib Tech TRS 157 and T. Rice Pro 157, I just bought a Never Summer Proto CT 160 for this year. I think the waist on these boards are around 25.3-25.5 I like to play around launching wind lips and dropping cliffs, but I don’t really spin much. I wear size 10 Salomon Snaypse with 12 in front and -9 in back. Any thoughts on board length and waist width? Do you think 25cm is too narrow?
August 27, 2014 at 5:08 pm #677173Jefe009ParticipantFWIW I ride size 10 boots and have had a 163/25 Zephyr and a 160/25 Odin and never had a problem with boot overhang.
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August 27, 2014 at 9:02 pm #677174barrowsParticipantyou need to consider a few things: Stance width and angles, whether or not the board has significant taper, and sidecut depth. Ultimately, the board width at the foot positions not the waist) is what is really going to matter if you want to get it right.
I prefer boards with less sidecut, on my furberg it has a 27 waist, but the width at the foot posits is the same as my Venture Storm with a 26 waist, so do not only think of waist width alone.
That being said, with a 10 boot you could probably get away with either a 25 or 26 in a Venture Storm or Zelix. If float in powder is a priority, I would go with the 26 for the extra surface area, on the other hand, if your priority is super fast response edge to edge, then go with the 25. Just be really careful when going narrower about boot centering and stance positions, especially if you plan to ride anything really steep where even a little boot out can be hazardous to your health.FYI: I ride a NS Prospector 167X with size 28 Dynafit boots, and Ventures with a 26 waist…
August 28, 2014 at 5:02 pm #677175Jason4ParticipantIf I had a size 10 with those stance angles I’d be on the 26cm board for sure.
FWIW, I’m a 10.5 in Driver Xs and a 28.5 in Dynafit the Ones @ +27*f/+6*r and 26cm seems to be my sweet spot but like Barrows said, it depends on the rest of the shape of the board.
August 28, 2014 at 6:13 pm #677176imported_MountainDogParticipantI have sz10 Malumutes and 28 TLT5s and I’ve rode my 163/25 Zephyr +20/-5 with no problems.
I demo’d a 26 Zelix and could feel a slight decrease in edge to edge quickness as well as a decrease in hard packed side hilling in tour mode.
Like Barrows said, are you looking for quicker turning or more float?August 28, 2014 at 8:29 pm #677177Jason4ParticipantMy biggest concern with a narrow splitboard is booting out when it would be dangerous to do so. If you’re not riding hard snow at 45* then it’s probably not a problem. It’s a bit different than just laying out trenches on groomers where the consequence is a slush rash and some embarassement if you sit it down. I’ll take the extra width and the float and weight that comes with it in trade for better edge contact when could already be stressful.
I’ve had a couple of T.Rices (a 164.5 and a 161.5) and now I’m on a Solution 163W but I’m thinking about maybe changing it to a Hovercraft split instead.
August 29, 2014 at 12:56 am #677178NeverSummerParticipantthanks for the replies.
I would prefer quick edge to edge, but being out here in CO, I hope to be hitting some deep pow, so this is why i’m torn between the two
August 29, 2014 at 10:28 am #677179ruapehu_explorerParticipantI have size 10 boots and went through the same decision as you, I ultimately chose a 26 waist (Zephyr 160).
Generally my board waist choice is mid 25.5ish, but I’ve ridden wide boards before for pow so I knew I could throw it around if it turned out wider than ideal. But I don’t really feel like I’m throwing it around, I don’t notice it as a wide board at all. And I’m only 165-170 so lighter than you, and (unfortunately) I don’t get deep fluffy much so my riding is on firmer conditions.
I made my choice based on what Barrows wrote earlier about width vs sidecut. I estimated that going slightly bigger waist width than I was used to at 26cm would be closer to my norm than the 25cm model on the basis that
1: the Zephyr’s average sidecut radius was a bit longer than normal resort boards I was on and
2: according to a response from Venture their sidecuts are longer in the middle of the board and goes shorter towards to tips – so I figured that would mean the sidecut from foot to foot was a longer radius than their listed spec (estimated average). And like barrows said, wider waist for longer sidecut can give you the same underfoot. It was just a guess, but I’m happy with the width.Anyways if you’ve ridden a Trice 157, I would think that is probably be a close comparison in terms of board width for your feet. Isn’t that a 25.8cm waist, with a 8.2m radius (shorter radius than a zephyr) so I would guess that would probably be about the same or wider underfoot. Did that feel too wide?
August 29, 2014 at 1:13 pm #677180barrowsParticipantFor here in Colorado, I would recommend erring on the side of wider. We have low density snow here, and float is at a premium. At your weight you are going to want as much surface area as you can handle.
In the backcountry, edge to edge response is not really the same thing as in a resort, as one is almost always riding some type of soft snow, and with the rocker, the Ventures are very manueverable for their size/width in penetrable snow conditions.
Also consider: I have never had a edge to edge response “problem” riding a Venture Storm 166×26 with my size 28 boots (rough equivalent to US 10). I also have a Prospector 167X, which is nominally even wider, although the tail is narrower due to its significant taper, this board is also plenty quick to turn.August 29, 2014 at 8:58 pm #677181TaylorParticipantWider will float a little better, turn and plane a little easier at lower speeds in tight terrain, and it’ll reduce the risk of dangerous boot-out. Echo Barrows on Venture maneuverability; my 181/27 Storms ride very loose for their size, especially in the tail. (And if it’s any consolation for fretting about 26 cm, my next split, now being cooked up with an eye toward low density snow, will have 29cm width under my size 12 back foot, and that’s with a large SCR.)
@sun_rocket
September 1, 2014 at 1:07 am #677182moridinbgParticipantI rode 25cm NS Summit 161 split for 3 seasons and I am doing a few weeks in Chile now with 26cm Venture Odin 165. Honestly, I can’t tell the difference in waist. The profile is kind of simillar – taper (less on the Odin) and setback. Go wide if you have boot size concerns.
In my book longer is better. I ride trees, tight chutes, like to play around with turns and haven’t had issues with the 165 in the Odin.September 3, 2014 at 3:31 pm #677172pow_hndParticipantI wear sz10 and ride a 26cm board. I would never ride a 25, would defiantly boot out in some situations. I did have a 25.5 board a few years ago and even now I wouldn’t go back to that. Plus as other people have stated, the 26cm board is gonna give you more surface area and is gonna float better in pow…
@ty_bee
@801splitters
September 3, 2014 at 9:38 pm #677183NeverSummerParticipantGreat advise, thanks for all the response. I think i’ll probably go with the 26. I’ve begun to look at the NS summit…looks so sweet, but i’m concerned with the amount of taper. first world problems….
September 4, 2014 at 4:05 am #677184barrowsParticipantYeah, I pretty much love taper, to a point… Too much taper is not for me, boards like the Unicorn Chaser are super fun, but the tail is a little too twitchy for me, but some folks love them, and in the right spots I can see it as well. I like 15 to 20 mm taper with the stance set back about 40-50 mm. It seems there is no compromise involved in taper up to 20 mm (excepting switch riding) and the taper just makes things better.
For awhile I thought taper of 15 or 20 mm would be too much for sketchy steeps (I was worried about losing edge power in the tail) but I was wrong. The Prospector has 20 mm of taper and holds like demon on sketchy steeps if you need it to.
Jacob (skierconqueso) had a summit split for awhile, he ripped on it for all around freeriding. Not just in pow…September 4, 2014 at 2:46 pm #677185TaylorParticipant@NeverSummer wrote:
Great advise, thanks for all the response. I think i’ll probably go with the 26. I’ve begun to look at the NS summit…looks so sweet, but i’m concerned with the amount of taper. first world problems….
Unless you ride a lot of switch, I think you’ll probably like the taper. My go-to ride, a 187, has about 3.5 cm of taper. That’s a lot of taper, but as a proportion of board length, it’s not as much as it’d seem. I really like it and am a big proponent.
Taper has the affect of planing the board in pow in a way that better handles front leg pressure and even pressure between legs. It trims it slightly nose-high. If your riding style involves forward-back weight throws, like charging forward and pumping off of terrain, you’ll dig it.
It also has the affect of loosening the tail, which allows it to get through a turn apex faster, makes tight-terrain slarving easier, and makes it easier to get the board around onto edge on steeps.
If designed with a stiff enough tail, and with not too much tail rocker (I’m almost certain NS nailed these design issues), it retains the tail stability you need at speed, on steeps, or for putting on the brakes.
In any case, all of the above are good for riding backcountry if you don’t ride switch. (If you do ride switch, then it’s whole different story.)
As Barrows notes, there is certainly a point at which, in combination with other design attributes, there can be too much taper… But I doubt the Summit crosses that line.
@sun_rocket
September 4, 2014 at 3:27 pm #677186Jason4ParticipantTo echo the comments on taper, my favorite board ever was an Option Pintail from ~2001. If I remember right it had 20mm of taper, half way between a Burton Malolo and a Fish of the same era. I rode the Option Northshore from the same year and didn’t care much for it because it had too much taper and the nose would get kicked around in crud too much for my taste.
I would be worried that it was golden memories of my favorite board from 10 years ago but I broke a board on a pow day at Baker last season and was lucky enough to have the Pintail in my box for some strange reason. I rode it the rest of the day and marvelled at how nice it was to have a board with traditional camber, a firm flex pattern, and a bit of taper. Now my go to pow board (and likely my everyday ride) is a Jones Hovercraft 160, I’d ride the Pintail more but I don’t want to damage or break that board.
September 4, 2014 at 9:05 pm #677187NeverSummerParticipantWell damn. Now I’m really eyeing a 164 Never Summer Summit Split. I guess this is why I want to split…to get freshies. So why not have a pow specific board? Do you guys think the set back stance is ok? I mean, 1.625 in. set back seems like a lot?? I like the waist size at 25.4, right in the middle. I guess my concern now is having too short of a tail.
September 9, 2014 at 11:08 pm #677188powderjunkieParticipantI have a 10us boot. I’ve been on a couple boards with a 25cm waist and it was great for corn/chutes and no boot drag. But I prefer 26 for an all around width.
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