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 Post subject: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:52 am 
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So guys,got the Karakorams Split30/Jones Solution set up for this season,was mega excited and my first 3 days riding and touring were insane,loved everything about this setup.
Then rode a resort day and hit some groomers,felt pretty good too i must say.
Day 4,bluebird pow day -25c in the duffey and one of the best runs of my life,on the run out at the bottom near the highway i decided to straighline through a little alder scrub,then bang my binding breaks free from my back foot,below photo shows the damage,the little ear on my back foot outside breaks off!
Emailed Bryce at karakoram and he was very surprised to see this happen as he said the stuff is rated to 127,000PSI,he reckons it could have cracked in the bending process.

Then while upon closer inspection of my board,the plates are both bending up off the board,pic below if the front foot plate which is worse than the back plate(where ear broke off)
Then upon another close inspection i found my front clip to be a little loose when clamped fully down and not holding the board together 100%

Bryce has agreed to replace the parts or give me my money back,i think i am going to get my money back,im really not too happy and the clip being loose is just the icing on the cake.
I got a Venture Odin this year and the construction of this board is mindblowing,not a shimmer of light down the middle,where as the Jones - a nice board,but mass produced compared to a hand crafted Venture i gotta say

Anyways,please opinions from anyone on what to do here,kinda on the fence

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:37 pm 
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Location: near munich
the flex of the board kills the baseplate, the baseplate kill the flex - this is it what you se, voile sliderpucks are verry small and damping by elastome kunststoff, the karakoram is so muchbigger and 100% stiffy, and full as metall - and kill the flex line, they need more damping under the base, and must rounded like a bow, but this not a big problem to bring the baseplate to the finshline. i think this is a littel start up problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:52 pm 
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Crazy! There have been hundreds of days by hard riders using K'rams and this is the first I've heard of this. If Russman hasn't broken these things in his 200+ days on his original thrashed but very intact pair then I don't see how this isn't anything but a strange fluke. As far as some theory about the metal base plates killing flex or w/e mine ride amazing but I'm always for improvement!. Krams are more than proven. That sucks though. Maybe next year they can beef up that bracket if it happens to someone else. How big are you btw? Good thing you didn't hurt yourself.

As far as trading in a solution for a venture. Well, maybe it's just me but I'd rather have the performance of a solution over a pretty seam. I don't get why people think a little light showing through the middle of the board matters :lol: The only Venture I've ridden while being beautifully constructed had the response of a 2x8.


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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:18 pm 
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Location: Chamonix
BGnight wrote:
Crazy! There have been hundreds of days by hard riders using Karakorams and this is the first I've heard of this. If Russman hasn't broken these things in his 200+ days on his original thrashed but very intact pair then I don't see how this isn't anything but a strange fluke. As far as some theory about the metal base plates killing flex or w/e mine ride amazing but I'm always for improvement!. Karakorams are more than proven. That sucks though. Maybe next year they can beef up that bracket if it happens to someone else. How big are you btw? Good thing you didn't hurt yourself.

As far as trading in a solution for a venture. Well, maybe it's just me but I'd rather have the performance of a solution over a pretty seam. I don't get why people think a little light showing through the middle of the board matters :lol: The only Venture I've ridden while being beautifully constructed had the response of a 2x8.


Yeah i hear ya about the seam,the Solution rides insane,the Odin is for big Alpine days only and going fast,big turns and drops
i weigh 170,so not big by any standards,Bryce says he knows of guys 220+ so yes maybe a fluke.

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:46 pm 
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yeah they got a set in World boards, i could bent the piece that the toe slides into before you lock it down with my fingers, no dice

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:11 am 
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:nononno: But they revolutionized the splitboard industry lol.. and there ultra light, and sidehill like a fruitbooter, how can this be :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:05 am 
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NatasKaput wrote:
yeah they got a set in World boards, i could bent the piece that the toe slides into before you lock it down with my fingers, no dice


What are you talking about?

Karakoram haters = people that can't afford them :lol:
They suck and break right? Must be why the best riders in the world are switching to them.


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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:10 pm 
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I've spent close to ten grand in World Boards, I'm not cheap. that stamped metal toe piece on the board, yeah i could bend that with two fingers where the binding hooks in. But I like their heelcup, it is in a snazzy color way. i don't care what the best riders are doing this season, because it is going to be something different next

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:54 pm 
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Location: The Belly of Ham baby!!
Woah! Amazing!

That's a very unfortunate metal failure. The only explanation for it has to be a flaw in that part's manufacturing. Like Bryce said, a crack could have formed in the stamping of the sheet... The part is rated to fail at many many thousands of pounds of force. The thing to remember is that mined metals are not always structurally perfect; there's always a possibility for structural variation. Of the thousands of tabs pressed this is the first ever failure.

Regarding people's experience of being able to "pull up" the toe attachment, this is supposed to happen. The binding is engineered to be spring loaded, or pre loaded onto the board. Therefore, deflection upward is essential, otherwise the system would inherently always have play and rattling.

I wouldn't totally give up on the bindings yet, it truly is an amazing interface, and every startup company experiences a few failures along the way.

Cheers everyone, russman. :headbang:

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:04 pm 
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I'm very surprised to see that type of failure - definitley not anything I've experienced. I normally don't post about gear, but it seems there's a hint of Karakoram bashing (or envy?) going on in the forum lately and I don't know why. From my perspective, competition in the gear market is a good thing, and the companies out there right now are pushing each other to make and deliver better products, and splitters are the benefactors.

I'm fortunate enough to have a set of both the Karakorams and the Spark Burners. Both have their pluses, but I find myself preferring the Karakoram setup in most cases. Both companies have excellent customer service too. I do think the Karakoram heel lifters need work though!

I agree about a few failures. It's bound to happen, it just sucks when it happens to you. Hope whichever way you turn it works out for you!

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:10 am 
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I'm got a pair of Blazes and will be getting my money back once i send back the Karakorams.

Yes what happened to me was probably a fluke,but it happened nonetheless,also very lucky i was'nt landing a drop or doing anything of more consequence,worse yet if it happened to Jeremy Jones or 1 of his crew who are advocates of this product,then the momentum of the Karakoram system might have come to a stop.
Just watched the video of the new Spark Edison and i think the people bashing the people bashing karkaorams will be changing camps when your 200g carbon fire binding and board is broken into pieces on the the ride up to the mountain :o

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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:21 pm 
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So this is the first ever incident of a Kram failing (from a guy who broke an LT pin his 3rd day inserting it in a hole!) and people are bashing them and automatically jumping on Sparks' nuts with their edison system which no one has even seen how it works or ridden (the DIY aspect of it is pretty cool). As I recall when the Ignition binder came out it was failing left and right. The WHOLE FUCKING BINDING WAS BREAKING (mine included). I know respected posters on here who went through MULTIPLE Ignitions from the entire baseplate fracturing and breaking!! You really think the two smartest guys in splitboard R and D (Bryce and Tyler) aren't gonna perfect what little flaws their system already has??? Spark started the revolution but I don't see why they're the only one's who get respect. The kram interface is proven and works beautifully. Now it's gonna just be a matter of preference for people. I prefer Kram mainly cuz their binding is better than the Blaze in riding performance. If Spark actually designs a binding that rides well (my opinion) with the edison and it's proven to be a bomber interface then I'll consider it. I'm just amazed at how much skepticism Kram got when they came out and everyone is already hailing the Edison system as the greatest thing since refrigeration.


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 Post subject: Re: Karakoram breaking after couple of days
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:43 pm 
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Spark had tons of issues in the beginning, no doubt. Hell, they had problems last year with their straps and buckles. So did Karakorum since they used the same source.

Regardless, it is kind of funny with band wagon jumping. Everyone wanted Karakorum, they are still polishing the product. A few sweet things for their line up next year. One of them being the ability to lock down your binding in skin mode. If you are doing rolling terrain out, this is going to be super handy.

I have to say that the Edison looked very polished. Spark has been in the game for a few more years than Karakorum and they are starting to show that experience.


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