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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:36 pm 
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Amplid
Thanks for the reply, I don't think you are being defensive at all. Its refreshing to know Amplid has thought this through. I can see the potential of a 163 with the surface area of a 175 to plane up similarly - The feel will differ, but at least your objectives are grounded in reality. I can't say the same for another mfg who implies some sort of bong-dream-magic will make a 140-ish plank float like a 170+ pow stick.

The Morning split sounds like it could be a quiver of one for many riders.

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:11 pm 
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I'm a big fan of one board for everything. I've mostly owned twins and directional twins, and I've never understood the need for a "special" board for powder or steeps, especially since rocker came into play. The steeper the terrain, the less a directional board will help you. I also don't understand why so many on here want giant or reverse sidecuts. Yeah, there's a point where the board gets too turny (maybe under 8.5ish), but it's easier to make big turns on a smaller sidecut radius than vice versa. I like being able to carve turns in a tight 50 degree chute, and then open it up with turns the size of football fields when on an open face. I'm sold on rocker-camber such as NS or Lib, but for splitting might be better to go flat between the bindings and a bit more early rise in the tip and tail. I also like bomber construction, and don't might a tad more weight for a board that will take a beating. One thing I've been wondering about for a while is a twin shape with a notch taken out of the tip and tail, almost a twin swallowtail, but still allowing the bard to plane in pow.

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:15 pm 
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World"s heaviest split board.... I'd buy it.... Come on guys. Why complicate things?

Seriously though, don't ask us for inspiration, that's what you are here for. Surprise us!


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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 1:29 am 
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shredgnar wrote:
World"s heaviest split board.... I'd buy it.... Come on guys. Why complicate things?

Seriously though, don't ask us for inspiration, that's what you are here for. Surprise us!


Just a bit of market research... there's no point in building the most inspriring and innovative splitboard on the market if nobody wants to buy it. Imagine if we'd designed something like the Burton Spliff and then asked the Forum's opinion!

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 1:41 am 
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firstlight wrote:
Amplid
Perhaps a shape shack style option for wanabe board shapers is the go?

We manufacture surfboards and we offer "shape your own" options for those that want to!
Slightly higher cost but it gives the rider a placebo effect and they think they have shaped the perfect board.
All boards are designed on computer with a simple surf design CAD package, like boardcrafter or snocad and cut on a CNC shaping machine.
You could offer this service too perhaps?
If you had a fully adjustable press that allows any rocker profile you could start to invite shapers from around the world to your factory and get these ideas from virtual concepts to reality!

I'm sure you would get a lot of R&D options from this sort of operation!

:twocents:


Hey Firstlight,

THat's a nice idea, but manufacturers like Prior and Venture are already doing a good job of this. By the time we'd accounted for the tooling, set-up costs and the labour hours associated with using a prototype mould the cost of a single board would be ridiculous. Also, I think if customers are looking for the ultimate custom shaping experience then they need to work with a local manufacturer where the designer can consult on the shape from his experience of the local terrain and snow conditions. We're more of batch manufactuerer who likes to experiment with curiosities rather than a custom board builder. I agree, it would be nice to see more surfboard-style independent snowboard "shapers" building custom boards for particular customers, that's just not Amplid.

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 8:00 am 
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Amplid wrote:
shredgnar wrote:
World"s heaviest split board.... I'd buy it.... Come on guys. Why complicate things?

Seriously though, don't ask us for inspiration, that's what you are here for. Surprise us!


Just a bit of market research... there's no point in building the most inspriring and innovative splitboard on the market if nobody wants to buy it. Imagine if we'd designed something like the Burton Spliff and then asked the Forum's opinion!



I know, just giving you a hard time. I commend your efforts.


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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 8:10 am 
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But on a serious note, kinda

Some sort of different mounting system would be nice, like slider tracks. Don't know what the patent deal is, or if they would work with both Voile and Karakoram, but this seems to be the next step.

Heaviest splitboard on the market, think about it... for training. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 8:51 am 
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fustercluck wrote:
The steeper the terrain, the less a directional board will help you. I also don't understand why so many on here want giant or reverse sidecuts. Yeah, there's a point where the board gets too turny (maybe under 8.5ish), but it's easier to make big turns on a smaller sidecut radius than vice versa. I like being able to carve turns in a tight 50 degree chute, and then open it up with turns the size of football fields when on an open face.


No one wants reverse sidecuts on the meat of the board. We're just talking on the nose/tail to avoid hooking. This is especially for steeps. And no one is carving turns on a 50 degree slope. You're skidding no matter what you think you're doing and a longer sidecut is going to help you. How does a directional board hinder you on steeps??? :scratch:

And it's easier to make bigger turns with a smaller sidecut???! :scratch: :scratch: :scratch:


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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:16 am 
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BGnight wrote:
fustercluck wrote:
The steeper the terrain, the less a directional board will help you. I also don't understand why so many on here want giant or reverse sidecuts. Yeah, there's a point where the board gets too turny (maybe under 8.5ish), but it's easier to make big turns on a smaller sidecut radius than vice versa. I like being able to carve turns in a tight 50 degree chute, and then open it up with turns the size of football fields when on an open face.


No one wants reverse sidecuts on the meat of the board. We're just talking on the nose/tail to avoid hooking. This is especially for steeps. And no one is carving turns on a 50 degree slope. You're skidding no matter what you think you're doing and a longer sidecut is going to help you. How does a directional board hinder you on steeps??? :scratch:

And it's easier to make bigger turns with a smaller sidecut???! :scratch: :scratch: :scratch:


I think you've misunderstood fustercluck's comment.
Quote:
The steeper the terrain the less a directional board will help you
. In other words you don't need the directionsl shape so much to assist with floatation in steep terrain. The other point was that making long drawn-out turns with a small sidecut radius is easier than making short radius turns on a board with a long sidecut radius.

Shredgnar - Slider tracks are a nice addition. I think it was Revolution snowboards that owned the original patent... there must be a royalty fee, but it's certainly worth investigating. Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:23 am 
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BGnight wrote:
fustercluck wrote:
The steeper the terrain, the less a directional board will help you. I also don't understand why so many on here want giant or reverse sidecuts. Yeah, there's a point where the board gets too turny (maybe under 8.5ish), but it's easier to make big turns on a smaller sidecut radius than vice versa. I like being able to carve turns in a tight 50 degree chute, and then open it up with turns the size of football fields when on an open face.


No one wants reverse sidecuts on the meat of the board. We're just talking on the nose/tail to avoid hooking. This is especially for steeps. And no one is carving turns on a 50 degree slope. You're skidding no matter what you think you're doing and a longer sidecut is going to help you. How does a directional board hinder you on steeps??? :scratch:

And it's easier to make bigger turns with a smaller sidecut???! :scratch: :scratch: :scratch:

I'll try to clarify this for you. I'm talking carving more as opposed to making jump turns. Yeah, there's probably gonna be a little skidding, but I'm talking about a clean transition from edge to edge. I don't think a directional board hinders on steeps. I just think it is not so necessary on steeps, especially in pow where much of the nose is out of the snow. Again, I like a board that can do everything, including spin and ride switch as well as steeps, so I like a more balanced stance.
And I'm not saying it is easier to make bigger turns with a smaller sidecut. I'm saying doing that is easier than making tight turns with a bigger sidecut, and tight turns tend to be more crucial, yet it is still possible to lay out big turns on a (relatively) smaller sidecut.
Goes to show the differences in opinion on board construction, as we tend to ride the same terrain (often together with same conditions), yet we look at and ride the mountain differently, which reflects our equipment choices.

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:35 am 
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I’m just a consumer, not a builder, so maybe take my advice with a grain of salt. I agree, the number one improvement that splitboards need is some sort of snow-shedding technology on the topsheet.

Channels for pucks instead of inserts seems like a no-brainer…?

I think lighter is better, insofar as it doesn’t affect durability. A durable board is worth some extra weight.

As you point out, you need to sell boards and can’t afford to get too risky with shapes. So you want to invest in innovations that you can get some return on. I think light boards that do a great job at shedding snow would be a great offering. My :twocents:

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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 11:19 am 
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Amplid wrote:
The other point was that making long drawn-out turns with a small sidecut radius is easier than making short radius turns on a board with a long sidecut radius.


But you can do both with a long radius. You can only do one with a short radius. From Tom Burt of Winterstick (keep in mind he's a math teacher too):

"Sidecut: I use an 11 meter radial sidecut. Why such a straight sidecut compared to most boards? Two reasons: The ability to do both large- and small-radius carving turns, and control at speed. For turning, sidecut dictates the carve. If a board has a short sidecut, say 8 meters, a carve with this radius is the biggest turn it can make. If you try to do a longer turn you will have to release your edge and slide it, thus losing edge control during the turn. Besides, one reason you go for a longer turn is to keep speed up, and if you have to slide the edge that kills your speed. Starting with a straighter sidecut allows a long turn while carving. Tighter turns while carving are possible by flexing the board. You control the radius of the carve by adjusting the way you flex the board. A board with an 11 meter sidecut can be bent to carve an 8 meter turn, but a board with an 8 meter sidecut can never carve an 11 meter turn, only eight or smaller. Finally, control at speed is a big factor of a larger sidecut. A short sidecut makes a board edgy and abrupt, so there’s a danger of catching edges when you try to cruise fast."

I'd go back to a winterstick splitboard if they didn't weight 200lbs :lol: . I loved my 162 ST on steeps!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Amplid LAB - We want to hear your Splitboard ideas!
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 11:24 am 
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Might as well throw in some more of T.B.'s snowboard knowledge about taper:

Taper: I have been a backer of taper since I started snowboarding. If you look at the Wintersticks of the past, the swallow and roundtails, you see they were all about taper. Taper gives you the ability to ride powder and still be able to weight your front foot. Taper also helps with tracking and finishing turns with the board still pointing down the hill. My board is designed with 4mm of taper. This amount of taper allows my board to track well on hard pack as well as powder, but at the same time it allows it to finish a turn with the board pointing down the hill. This means it takes less energy, effort and force to roll from one turn to the next, and you can ride with your upper body stable and still. Taper also lets the back of the board sink in powder and thus more weight can be applied to the front of the board. You have more control because you are not leaning back (a position you never want to be in when you ride). Taper also shifts the center of sidecut toward the back of the board. This allows the rider’s stance to be shifted to the back of the board but still be over the sidecut, giving great control due to a positive edge. The best way to feel what taper does is to ride a board with taper, then go back to a board without it. You should feel the difference. A board without taper will want to finish its turn across the fall line, not down the fall line. It won’t let the tail sink in powder unless your weight is shifted back, and it will catch edges easily when tracking straight.


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