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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2014 9:28 pm 
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Taylor
My thoughts exactly on the cap construction?
The Artisan boards were very nice, not sure why they have gone back to cap?
Might be due to it being a "prototype" style board.
I've never used pattern bases so I'm interested in seeing how much grip there really is.

The effective edge is interesting, my 170 has a 109 effective edge and I found it great in the pow with the long nose and tail.
12mm of taper IMO is not that radical!

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:35 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 4:09 pm
Posts: 137
I snow board in powder, otherwise ski but...
I have four pair of capped skis and two capped splitters.
The 165 revelator I'm using is a beat to shit demo with two core shots.
It has been to 40° slopes, no problem.
Have not had any durability issues on any capped constructed skis or boards.
I'll take the light weight and not worry about urban legends.
I'm also using kwicker bindings with old K2 Ace boots for safety, weight and ease of transition reasons so,
as a geriatric spit boarder, works for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:47 pm 
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Location: London/Berlin
Real 90s shredding with cap and kwicker!
Scales sounds good, but how do they perform in the wet? Any problems with snow stiction?

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:03 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:05 am
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Location: Colorado
I am not in favor of the scales, I have a hard time imaging where they would really help (OK I guess on split ski exits with slight uphills and flats), but the downsides seem many: difficulty in waxing (one must remove all excess wax from the scale area, lest it contaminate skins), less adhesion of skins to the board in the scale area, more difficulty in repairing rock damage...
I hope that Voile will also produce the Revelator with a traditional base option. This board is the best looking thing I have seen from Voile, I'll bet it is a ripper.
And I have no love for cap boards, yes they can be made a little lighter, but there are very good reasons that almost all board manufacturers abandoned cap construction years ago...

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 5:16 pm 
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I don't imagine myself ever buying a scaled board, it just sounds like a cool idea.
I believe the purpose of scales is exactly to not use skins. Makes sense for saving weight and much better skiing. But most weight saving will be in wet skinning and to me so much uneven surface will only get full of snow, but they have been making fish scale skis for ages, so maybe it's not that bad.

I was wondering how do you wax the scales, but apparently you don't... You wax only the normal flat section...

Fascinating niche product.

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:08 am 
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Location: Salida, Flagstaff
I was assuming this board was intended as a niche quiver board--one for low-angle approaches and storm days, not for reliable use with skins due to poorer adhesion from discontinuous contact with the base and snow wedging into the scale troughs.

But maybe it works fine with skins.

It's too bad that Voile is so focused on scales and slider tracks when they talk about this board; in my opinion those are silly gimmicks compared to the shaping, which would be far more interesting to hear about.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9rL3vWudzc[/youtube]

I agree with Barrows that this is a promising shape--a nice departure from Voile's standard fare. I hope they offer larger sizes (c'mon, four lengths in a 10cm span? Really?), standard, non-scaled bases and (non-cap) construction. Give us a 180. This shape with a rocker-matched long SCR (suspicion thereof prompted this thread) would be, a la Furberg and DPS, stellar.

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 2:53 am 
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Why do you guys think that the rocker being the same radii as the sidecut matters? Rocker is dynamic and changes as soon as you weight the board.
I bet you wouldnt notice a difference if it was 10m or 20m.


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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 8:28 am 
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Don't know if it holds much promise for folks interested in the specs, but didn't Jive mention that both Revelator's he test rode had no scales?

As far as waxing/skins; it's a simple matter not to drip wax on that section if you don't want to have to clean it off. And the intention from Voile appears to be that one uses both the scales (rolling terrain) and skins (ascending).

As far as cap goes, I've had two Voile's with cap construction and had zero durability issues.The bigger problem in my mind was with the Mojo. Because it was capped along the inner edges there simply wasn't not enough contact area. As a result the halves were constantly popping over/under one another between, fore and aft of the bindings (same for two V-Tail's I tested). A deal breaker personally, but the Mojo certainly didn't fall apart and went on to live out its days in the east coast woods.

On the other hand, my 195 swallowtail is only capped on the outer edges with the center being sidewall and its bomber! (did I mention its a 2002). And of course anyone who knows the whacky lowtide bushwhacks I do, knows I hardly baby my gear. I love this board and the mix of cap/sidewall.
:twocents:

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 2:07 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 4:09 pm
Posts: 137
^^^
Got the same 195 outer edge cap swallowtail. It hasn't been on snow in two years because we haven't seen a big storm.

Image

I've been testing equipment for Voile over 25 years, including split boards since day one.
Currently trying the 165 and a cob job dynafit toe, cable heel, bellowed AT boot, mounted on next years V6 ski.
All the stuff is proto, the board has already been changed with the latest, a half a pound lighter, more camber.
Will try that if it snows again.
As can be seen in the photo, no fish scales and a beat up base.
Kwicker binding issues linger and there is no boot. Mine work better than what's available, with locking adjustable forward lean and thermofit liner.
I snowboard on snowboard boots because of the comfort with little interest in using ski boots for snowboarding.
Not the best skier and certainly not the best snowboarder. I am, however, a good tester because of honesty in likes and dislikes.
I like the board.
Doubt I'll demo a fish scale Revelator. Not real interested in low angles.
Over and out.


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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 3:12 pm 
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Location: Colorado
Snurfer wrote:
Don't know if it holds much promise for folks interested in the specs, but didn't Jive mention that both Revelator's he test rode had no scales?

As far as waxing/skins; it's a simple matter not to drip wax on that section if you don't want to have to clean it off. And the intention from Voile appears to be that one uses both the scales (rolling terrain) and skins (ascending).

As far as cap goes, I've had two Voile's with cap construction and had zero durability issues.The bigger problem in my mind was with the Mojo. Because it was capped along the inner edges there simply wasn't not enough contact area. As a result the halves were constantly popping over/under one another between, fore and aft of the bindings (same for two V-Tail's I tested). A deal breaker personally, but the Mojo certainly didn't fall apart and went on to live out its days in the east coast woods.

On the other hand, my 195 swallowtail is only capped on the outer edges with the center being sidewall and its bomber! (did I mention its a 2002). And of course anyone who knows the whacky lowtide bushwhacks I do, knows I hardly baby my gear. I love this board and the mix of cap/sidewall.
:twocents:


Snurfer: I could see how you guys in the Wasatch may not have any durability problems with cap construction. The Wasatch has a fairly deep snowpack in comparison to our Rocky Mountains here in CO. Here, we hit a lot more rocks, and we hit them hard. After a few trips to the Wasatch I could see how the weight savings of a cap board might be OK for riding there, I do not think I have ever taken a hard rock shot there, unless one were to ride the outracks to low elevation in Big Cottonowood.

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 5:21 pm 
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barrows wrote:
unless one were to ride the outracks to low elevation in Big Cottonowood.
Bingo!
All chiding aside, you make valid points for riders in a broad range of scenarios.

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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:57 pm 
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I would buy this board in a heart beat. Not everyone lives in the Front Range with roads going right up the mountainside.

The scales on the new Voile look awesome! My only complaint is the scales go from edge to edge. A row in the middle would have been better. I am an avid xc skier and scales have proven to be the time-tested go to for long tours in AK. Also, you don't wax scales you goof balls. If you do, just use the slide wax (looks like deodorant). It doesn't mess with skins, I promise.

Quite a few areas I like to split require this pattern: Flat ski in, steep skin up, steep ride down in board mode, switch back to ski mode and go out w/ no skins (making little hills more difficult than needs be with awkward side steps).

I board with skiers and am always trying to keep up the best I can. The board w/ scales would make the most boring and slow-going part of this routine much faster. Sorry, guys I can't pump and carry my momentum for a mile of flats. I guess I was just born in the wrong state for such skills :thumpsup: Scales are the king of rolling terrain. The downs are nice (skins suck for this) and it would be even nicer to get a good glide going on the flats and rollers.


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 Post subject: Re: Voile Revelator - long taper, long scr shape?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:45 am 
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Location: Colorado
skijor: totally agreed, as I mentioned the scales would be nice, especially for long exits while split skiing. And, BTW, here in CO we have plenty of longer, flatter approaches/exits as well, not everywhere is like Berthoud Pass.
I think the scales are a specialized thing, which could be seen as useful for some riders/areas. I would just like to see them being an option rather than standard.

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http://protectourwinters.org/
http://14ersnowboardproject.homestead.com/


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