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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:32 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 8:51 am
Posts: 636
I think it's funny how you are trying to use physics to convince people to ride boards that are unnecessarily long. You act like float is the end all be all. Funny how your "rule of thumb" isn't being followed by 99% of riders. I think that puts you firmly into the realm of "fanatic". Keep trying though, it's pretty entertaining.


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:36 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:16 am
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Location: Salida, Flagstaff
Actually I'm not. I'm explaining why people ride the length of boards that they generally do. I think it's all a matter of personal preference. I prefer longer, others prefer shorter.

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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:42 am 
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shredgnar wrote:
I think it's funny how you are trying to use physics to convince people to ride boards that are unnecessarily long. You act like float is the end all be all. Funny how your "rule of thumb" isn't being followed by 99% of riders. I think that puts you firmly into the realm of "fanatic". Keep trying though, it's pretty entertaining.


How tall are you and what size boards do you ride?

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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:45 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 8:51 am
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6'2" 190

splitboard-168cm Solution
Solid- NS legacy 166 and 163, Titan 164


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:54 am 
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Location: Salida, Flagstaff
Yeah, you totally need a longer deck.

:rock:

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181 Venture Storm Solid and Split
173 Rossi Race DIY Swallowtail Split


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:56 am 
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Taylor wrote:
Yeah, you totally need a longer deck.

:rock:



Why yes, they do have rocker. I've been on a few longer decks. 195 Nitro swallowtail, a few 172 -175 NS's. They suck in the terrain I ride. Sluggish turning, and too long to fit in tight trees/chutes.

Like I said before, if big boards are your thing, then cool, go with it. It just reeks of compensation for other deficiencies to me.


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 10:00 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:05 am
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Location: Colorado
Taylor is correct. A longer board, properly designed, will offer more float for given weight of rider (considering the width of the board should be consistent with the riders boot size). In powder, more float, allows quicker turning at a given speed. Here's why:
A board/rider with more float, will be closer to surface of the snow, actually planing rather than ploughing. When the board is actually planing in powder, quick turning is very, very easy-regardless of board length, when the board is ploughing (nose up, tail sunk in the snow) turning happens much slower.
The board with more surface area will plane up quicker, at a lower speed, and be easy to turn, than a board which is ploughing through the snow.
Commonly used board lengths for general, intermediate, riders skidding their way from rail to rail in the resorts, are no example of what will offer the best performance for advanced riders in the backcountry, riding deep snow without a packed base a few inches below the surface.

Too bad K2 makes a cheap Chinese product these days, but the design of this split is nothing to write home about anyway-way too much sidecut for stability, and way too much marketing speak...

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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:10 pm 
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barrows wrote:
Commonly used board lengths for general, intermediate, riders skidding their way from rail to rail in the resorts, are no example of what will offer the best performance for advanced riders in the backcountry, riding deep snow without a packed base a few inches below the surface.




this is just laughable.... this whole thread in fact.

it might be true for your style of riding but what makes you think that everyone wants to ride like you?

i like to do tricks when i'm riding, and with a rockered board and a directional stance i don't really even need much length at all over my resort board as long as i keep my pack small...

when's the last time you threw even a 3 on one of those dogs Taylor?

the bottom line is this: it is another splitboard from a major company with alot of R&D and marketing potential behind it and on some level or another i see this as basically good for splitboarding. it will get more new people into the sport, put more used boards onto the market, hopefully drive competitors pricing down (yea right), and shit its K2s first one.
give em another year or two and they might be amazing. i really like K2s auto binding stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:20 am 
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Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:43 am
Posts: 47
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Watch out ShredLife you'll upset the boat riding powderjacks!


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:40 am 
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Posts: 636
If you guys are so concerned with staying on top of the snow, you could just ride groomers.


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:58 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2011 9:03 pm
Posts: 221
Location: British Columbia
We should all just be riding skis anyways


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:20 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:05 am
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Location: Colorado
You appear to be confusing preferences with facts:

"the bottom line is this: it is another splitboard from a major company with alot of R&D and marketing potential behind it and on some level or another i see this as basically good for splitboarding. it will get more new people into the sport, put more used boards onto the market, hopefully drive competitors pricing down (yea right), and shit its K2s first one.
give em another year or two and they might be amazing. i really like K2s auto binding stuff."

This is just another resort board designed for intermediate riders, made into a split. I sure hope that K2s made in china "value" does not force actual quality board makers (Never Summer, Prior, Winterstick, Venture) to try and compete, as to do so their board quality would have to drop.

I have no problem with you riding whatever equpment you might prefer-it is a free world. But your preferences do not change the physical facts about what works in backcountry conditions. Certainly, if doing spinning tricks is your priority, then a shorter board will make it easier to spin, at the same time the shorter board will have less float, will be less stable, and will be more difficult to turn in deep snow (due to lack of float). This is a tradeoff in performance which you are willing to accept for a board which is easier to spin.
I care not at all to do tricks, I care about a free ride performance in backcountry snow conditions, so I prefer a board whose control parameters are optimised for my prefered riding. And I (at 6'1", 170) can get a 173 around for a half cab cornice drop (which is the most appropriate trick I will ever attempt in my riding).

In any case, my main point, which many people reading here do not seem to understand, is that in deep snow (real powder, not resort riding with a 8" on top of a packed base) a board with more float is easier to turn quickly as this board will ride closer to the surface of the snow at a given speed. When the board is closer to the surface, quick turning is easy, even on a longer board, because the board's tail is not sunk down deep.
Consider the Jones Hovercraft, this board is designed to allow maximum float in a minimum package. It has the surface area (float) of a traditional 170 cm board in a smaller package. Now consider Jeremy Jones himself, he's like 5'6" or 5'7" at most. So size up the (170 equivalent) Hovercraft to your own height to consider how much more float would be nice to have.
Now region is also going to have an impact on this. It appears some riders on this thread may be in the eastern US (having location in your info might help here). I ride in the west, where we often have truly deep snow, and the terrain is bigger. I have ridden the woods of VT, and would probably choose a 164 with a bunch of taper for riding back there, as the the hardwood forests are tight and full of bushes, and the snow is almost never truly deep, so even on a powder day one is really riding on a firm base.

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Never Summer Prospector 167X, furberg 173 DIY, Dynafit TLT5/6 Mountain , Phantom Bindings, BD Glidelite Skins
Quiver Killer inserts

http://protectourwinters.org/
http://14ersnowboardproject.homestead.com/


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 Post subject: Re: K2 Panoramic splitboard 2011/2012
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:41 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:32 am
Posts: 90
i'm just gonna say this: ride whatever the fuck you want to.

if you want to ride 170+ you are in the minority of all snowboarders - backcountry and front - and not all companies are going to make boards for you.

you should take a long look at what you've been posting and your attitude towards this sport. splitboarding was not created as an outlet for snowboarders to act pretentious, and quite frankly you've never seen me ride powder just like i've never seen you.

i don't have any problems riding powder with my setup. never have. if i rode a 185 sure it'd be really really easy to stay on top.... but it would just suck to turn, suck to control in the air, more weight for skinning...

i just think the level of condescension by some members on this site is appalling. if you came with that retarded attitude in the skintrack or up on a mountain somewhere i'd just laugh in your face but here you have new riders that are coming here for advice. this stance of 'these are the physics, so this is always right' is ridiculous. yes, a longer board stays up easier - that is only part of the story.



...... if all you can do is half cabs off of a cornice then you are intermediate yourself or you're just old and scared.

hows that feel?


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