Forums Splitboards Voile 2010 Voile (Manufacturer) Thread
Viewing 20 posts - 21 through 40 (of 81 total)
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  • #627294
    aksltxlt
    621 Posts

    I dont think the Light rails are an improvement on the Voile system. You need to start with the plastic pucks. If you have a solid puck that goes across both halves of the board It will improve the stiffness from binding to board. Voile needs to make improvements to the pucks. The current manufactured pucks only attatch to each ski individually, and do not hang over to the other ski. Second I have never been a fan of Metal bindings(they break) Keep it simple when shit breaks in the BC (as it always does) you need a simple fix

    #627295
    rughty
    620 Posts

    I totally agree that the light rail isn’t an advancement in any way. It was a great business decision to take market share from Sparks in their inability to support the demand from the end user. My mod is only a poor man’s fix to keep my hard earned $$$ in my pocket and a statement to any manufacturer who stalls the advancement of our sport in favor of sitting on a patent only to suck every last dollar from us before introducing a new product so they can do it all over again. Screw big business. They have been doing it to us for years!!! Go Karakorum!!!

    #627296
    Snurfer
    1448 Posts

    Thanks to everyone that continues to participate in this thread. There are some good ideas and the persistence is just what we need to help manufacturers make informed ‘business’ decisions. (I know its about the ride, but it is some folks livelihood)

    I’d like to provide some perspective on Voile.

    This is a small grassroots company, not a mega corporation. The key players have sunk a shit ton of their time and money into it, and I’m pretty certain none of them are rich because of it. If you and your family’s financial security were tied to a patent that you came up with, I’m guessing you’d want to keep it close as well. Especially if you weren’t actually getting rich in the process.

    Much of Voile’s effort is spent keeping the Prior’s, Venture’s and resellers of the world in parts, not on making their own binders and boards. That being the case, it’s hard to take seriously the Voile criticisms that simultaneously prop up these other great companies.
    When Prior, Venture and others begin chiming in, then maybe you are onto something and I’ll gladly eat crow.

    Bottom line… Dave agreed to take the time to look in on this thread to hear our ideas, and constructive criticism. So go ahead and bug the shit out of him about stuff you’d like to see, and call their customer service if you feel like the product you bought didn’t meet your expectations. But please understand that this small company is NOT some evil corporate tyrant out to fuck everyone.

    Thanks!

    Shark Snowsurf Chuna
    Voile V-Tail 170 BC
    Voile One Ninety Five
    Spark R&D Arc

    #627297
    aksltxlt
    621 Posts

    Voile has always been rad when Ive dealt with them. Ive only purchased the kits and replacement parts from them, and thier customer service has been superb. I would like to see the Pucks change but untill then I will fab my own. Voile is in no way an Evil empire, but an Merican company down for the cause. Voile even sells its product in pieces if you need it, will Karokoram sell different parts of thier product? Only time will tell

    #627298
    Snurfer
    1448 Posts

    x2…. I’d love to see different pucks as well.

    It seems with contemporary machining, the pucks could be half, or two-thirds as tall and use a flush-head screw like the other hardware. Perhaps they would then need to be made out of a harder material to maintain the shape?
    I’d also like to see the ability to move the binder (via the pucks) toe-ward, or heel-ward (e.g., lose the two different slot patterns).

    Shark Snowsurf Chuna
    Voile V-Tail 170 BC
    Voile One Ninety Five
    Spark R&D Arc

    #627299
    Ecobrad
    2068 Posts

    I’ve said it before, Voile has the best customer service of any company I do business with, including professionally and private. Stuff like:

    Making sure their sending you the right nuts, bolts, etc. No matter who answers the phone the order arrives right (obviously double and triple checked) and they don’t try to make money off of shipping.

    They defer to the rider. If you say the injury is not normal wear and tear they don’t question you. It’s nice to be treated like they want your business back. I’ve never heard of anyone being offered a T-shirt and be told to deal with their $1,000 board defect somewhere else.

    PS I’m not gunning for a bromance. I’m the first to say that I don’t like the graphics or ride of the Freeride, Mtn. Gun or Mojo.

    #627300
    barrows
    1490 Posts

    I want stiffer, stronger pucks. I suspect that this could be (relatively) easy to accomplish with existing molds (I have worked in manufacturing and understand tooling costs). Long fiber carbon reinforced resin should do the trick.

    #627301
    wasatch surf
    979 Posts

    @rughty wrote:

    I totally agree that the light rail isn’t an advancement in any way. It was a great business decision to take market share from Sparks in their inability to support the demand from the end user. My mod is only a poor man’s fix to keep my hard earned $$$ in my pocket and a statement to any manufacturer who stalls the advancement of our sport in favor of sitting on a patent only to suck every last dollar from us before introducing a new product so they can do it all over again. Screw big business. They have been doing it to us for years!!! Go Karakorum!!!

    rughty grow up. voile employees between 10-15 people at most per year and is anything from big business. it is run by three ski bums that try to make good gear using local resources. this sport wouldn’t be here without voile and Wally’s willingness to take a risk on Cowboys idea.(if you don’t know who these people are, then you shouldn’t be talking shit in the first place.) When i worked there my time was spent doing everything from handling retail accounts, taking customer calls, putting stickers on shovel handles and package screws and pucks to send to venture, burton, prior, neversummer etc.. the point is voile does a lot with very little. if handcrafting skis and splitboards out of garage is big business, or if Dave, Mark, Matt and whoever else may be there now working 50+ hours a week to make sure all the customer service, ordering issues, parts issues, production issues are taken care of is big business, then voile is guilty i guess.

    as far as spark r and d goes it is a great company but i hardly think the lightrail is stealing anything from Will. Spark couldn’t even make enough fuse bindings to supply the demand this winter. seems like they are doing fine to me. Sparks continued success is based on the assumption that voile will be the industry standard for years to come. If karakorum takes over the world like you are campaigning for, will they allow Spark to infringe on their patent and build bindings compatible with the karakorum system?

    if you and russman(and yes i’m lumping you two together because of recent postings from both of you) are representative of karakorums attitude toward the rest of the splitboarding industry, then i want nothing to do with them. which is a shame because it looks like those dudes have worked their asses off to make a good product.

    the end.

    sorry for the thread drift but i can’t let uneducated comments like that slide.
    and ps-
    i don’t work for voile anymore and i don’t think voile is the greatest thing ever, in fact there is tons a shit they could improve on. some of the ideas are mentioned here. so lets keep this thread fairly constructive and keep giving ideas to voile instead of making inaccurate generalizations.

    #627302
    wasatch surf
    979 Posts

    @barrows wrote:

    I want stiffer, stronger pucks. I suspect that this could be (relatively) easy to accomplish with existing molds (I have worked in manufacturing and understand tooling costs). Long fiber carbon reinforced resin should do the trick.

    there has been a few people requesting stiffer/stronger pucks maybe it’s because i’m a little guy but i haven’t found the pucks to be too soft. Maybe i just don’t know what to look for, when do you guys experience the pucks having too much flex? have you guys ever broken/cracked a puck?

    I agree with snurfer that it seems like the pucks in general could be shaved down resulting in a lower fit, but then i guess that would mean that voile and spark would have to change their machining processes in making plates, and bindings.

    #627303
    barrows
    1490 Posts

    I broke the pucks on my front foot in half (universals), but the forces involved were pretty high (I missjudged a compression in flat light) and this failure may have prevented an ankle injury.
    In any case, mostly what I am looking for is stiffer pucks for better board response. Try this: set your board on the floor and attach your boots to the bindings. Then torque on the boots and watching the pucks flex away from the board-a stiffer puck would allow for better response and more precise control. The DIY pucks perform better in stiffness, because they are screwed down to the board at more points.
    I have been putting one ski screw through the outside corner of the universal pucks into the board (only do this when your stance is dialed) and this helps the board response a lot, but carbon fiber is the obvious solution to better universal pucks.

    #627304
    rughty
    620 Posts

    A little background so people know where I am coming from. I work for a semiconductor company in their research and development department. It is my job to establish new technology to get new and better products to our customers which in turn advances our company over the competitors. I have been in the industry for about 15 years and in R&D for the past 6. Product innovation is not new to me. If Voile doesn’t advance their technology, they will become a second rate company and fall to the “Karakorums” in the splitboard industry. I have seen this happen to many companies over the years. I think that any company who has made great contributions to the splitboard industry are invaluable, but they must continue to grow with the times or they will be quickly outdated.

    I agree that the light rail wasn’t “stolen” from Sparks. It simply is similar technology and was/is a short term answer for Sparks inability to keep up with production. Very smart business decision which is keeping Voile in the game due to a shortfall on Sparks behalf. Growing a business is a very difficult feat. If you grow too slowly, you will be overtaken by companies who have the capital to support faster growth. If you grow too quickly, then you lose market share and customer satisfaction drops off due to the inability of keeping up with the demand. People will go to a company who can supply them with the products they desire. That being said, customer loyalty is pretty much the only thing which goes against this, but in the end is only a small part of the percentage.

    I am not representative of Karakorums attitude. I have only spoken to them a few minutes here and there. I am interested to see how they do in this industry because they represent the splitboard industry in new product growth and innovation. They are risking (just as Voile and Sparks has done) quite a bit and have invested their blood, sweat and tears in providing us, the customer, with an alternative and possibly better product to go have fun on. I would love to see Karakorum do well in this industry and challenge any other company to come up with something better to answer their product.

    Voile and Sparks may not be corporate giants, but they are the biggest fish in the sea when it comes to splitboard products. They have the advantage in that they have years of experience and knowledge of the industry and what the end user is looking for.

    Isn’t this why this thread was started???

    And I am sure that Sparks isn’t infringing on Voile’s patent. I am sure that Sparks pays Voile to use their patent as most companies do.

    #627305
    182 Surf de neige
    157 Posts

    :disco: Asked the person helping with my order about the swally, and got nothin…. Come on guys, perhaps a custom order basis? 😥

    I agree Snurfer…Keep on buggin..MAS SWALLYYYY POR FAVOR…..

    And, I ve broken pucks as well… Not that it matters much , but this thread will help someone see what we are interested. To think there isn t even snow on the ground yet….Snow flies soon I suppose as summer slowly drifts south again…

    #627306
    182 Surf de neige
    157 Posts

    :disco: Asked the person helping with my order about the swally, and got nothin…. Come on guys, perhaps a custom order basis? 😥

    I agree Snurfer…Keep on buggin..MAS SWALLYYYY POR FAVOR…..

    And, I ve broken pucks as well… Not that it matters much , but this thread will help someone see what we are interested. To think there isn t even snow on the ground yet….Snow flies soon I suppose as summer slowly drifts south again…

    #627307
    Snurfer
    1448 Posts

    Yeah I’ve given up on Voile to bring back the swally…. Bugging them seems silly, since they have seen this thread and have not bothered to comment one way, or the other (on this, or any other request)…. :banghead:
    This is why I don’t get all bromantic about certain other companies. Riders pitch their wares for them on this forum and yet not a peep from most of them. :bow:
    Meanwhile, props to Karakoram and Spark for actually engaging with us about their products…. Anyways I could go on, but all that will do is get people all mad at me and stuff

    Shark Snowsurf Chuna
    Voile V-Tail 170 BC
    Voile One Ninety Five
    Spark R&D Arc

    #627308
    Snowman
    2 Posts

    No question about it Voile is a great company, particularly in the area of custom service. That being said, you have to remember that Voile is a ski company run and owned by skiers–it is not a snowboard company. I for one am really excited to see some competition for Voile in terms of other snowboard specific companies getting into the split game. I think it is a game changer and will really spur new innovation and development which, for me, has seemed at a stand-still for many years now. What I would like to see is for Voile to resurrect their idea of manufacturing a step-in boot/binding system for the splitboard. Such a system could literally reduce weight in terms of pounds not to mention it is far more convenient than the current system. If done correctly, for many of us, strap bindings in the backcounty would be a thing of the past.

    #627309
    rughty
    620 Posts

    I tried a variety of bindings this past season on my splitty including flow, step ins and strap bindings.

    Flow bindings sucked in the BC.

    I loved the ease of the step ins and they allowed me to get on my board super fast when conditions were less than perfect. The downside to my setup though was that the boots were heavy, bulky and sat further off the deck than all other setups. That being said, they were older vans step ins so I am not familiar with what other step ins would even be suitable. I do like the idea of step ins though. With a stiffer boot, front pointing crampons would be a little more comfortable too.

    Very little weight with the strap ins these days and boots are getting lighter.

    It would be totally sic if Karakoram got together with a boot manufacturer and put their technology in a boot sole. :doobie:

    #627310
    Snowman
    2 Posts

    I ride a K2 Clicker binding where the actual step-in mechanisms are mounted directly to the slider tract. Super light system and rides like a dream. The only problem is that the K2 boots I use are really outdated and heavy by today’s standards. If K2 was still making a step-in system with today’s boot technology it would be a no-brainer. Nothing could even come close in terms of weight savings since the binding is integrated into the boot.

    #627311
    Snurfer
    1448 Posts

    For the serious swallowtail (splitboard) crowd there might be good news. With fund raisers and movie premieres happening this week, I’ve had the good fortune to hang out with some good folks and have good discussions. One of the topics has been bringing back the swally! :clap:

    So…. those who are seriously interested let me know by PM and include the size 178/195. I will try and represent us a group as best I can and keep you informed. I’m looking for folks that are truly serious about buying a swally. If the numbers are there and the stars align, I think this will happen. It also couldn’t hurt to drop Voile a personal email letting them know you are serious about bringing back this classic ride.

    If this actually does happen (and it sounds as though it can), it will be driven by interest. As near as I can tell, it may be a build to order product, but it will still require committed rider interest to make it happen.

    I’m cautiously optimistoked :thumpsup:

    Shark Snowsurf Chuna
    Voile V-Tail 170 BC
    Voile One Ninety Five
    Spark R&D Arc

    #627312
    russman
    689 Posts

    @wasatch surf wrote:

    @rughty wrote:

    I totally agree that the light rail isn’t an advancement in any way. It was a great business decision to take market share from Sparks in their inability to support the demand from the end user. My mod is only a poor man’s fix to keep my hard earned $$$ in my pocket and a statement to any manufacturer who stalls the advancement of our sport in favor of sitting on a patent only to suck every last dollar from us before introducing a new product so they can do it all over again. Screw big business. They have been doing it to us for years!!! Go Karakorum!!!

    rughty grow up. voile employees between 10-15 people at most per year and is anything from big business. it is run by three ski bums that try to make good gear using local resources. this sport wouldn’t be here without voile and Wally’s willingness to take a risk on Cowboys idea.(if you don’t know who these people are, then you shouldn’t be talking shit in the first place.) When i worked there my time was spent doing everything from handling retail accounts, taking customer calls, putting stickers on shovel handles and package screws and pucks to send to venture, burton, prior, neversummer etc.. the point is voile does a lot with very little. if handcrafting skis and splitboards out of garage is big business, or if Dave, Mark, Matt and whoever else may be there now working 50+ hours a week to make sure all the customer service, ordering issues, parts issues, production issues are taken care of is big business, then voile is guilty i guess.

    as far as spark r and d goes it is a great company but i hardly think the lightrail is stealing anything from Will. Spark couldn’t even make enough fuse bindings to supply the demand this winter. seems like they are doing fine to me. Sparks continued success is based on the assumption that voile will be the industry standard for years to come. If karakorum takes over the world like you are campaigning for, will they allow Spark to infringe on their patent and build bindings compatible with the karakorum system?

    if you and russman(and yes i’m lumping you two together because of recent postings from both of you) are representative of karakorums attitude toward the rest of the splitboarding industry, then i want nothing to do with them. which is a shame because it looks like those dudes have worked their asses off to make a good product.

    the end.

    sorry for the thread drift but i can’t let uneducated comments like that slide.
    and ps-
    i don’t work for voile anymore and i don’t think voile is the greatest thing ever, in fact there is tons a shit they could improve on. some of the ideas are mentioned here. so lets keep this thread fairly constructive and keep giving ideas to voile instead of making inaccurate generalizations.

    I think the one who needs to grow up here is you, Wasatch.

    Absolutely no need to attack Rughty. Cut out the hating dude!

    What is up with you guys defending Voile so much? I mean seriously.. Sure they have supported splitting when nobody else has, but the bottom line is that there simply hasn’t been any true innovation for years. Isn’t it about time that new options were available for splitters? Particularly one’s that raise the bar for performance?

    Sheesh…. You’d think you guys would be stoked! Isn’t stoke what its all about, anyway?

    #627313
    Snurfer
    1448 Posts

    We defend these people because we know these people. At least we aren’t stalking them 😉

    Shark Snowsurf Chuna
    Voile V-Tail 170 BC
    Voile One Ninety Five
    Spark R&D Arc

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